Sunday, April 19, 2020

November No Shows?

from the New York Times
Mary Shippee voted for Senator Bernie Sanders in Wisconsin’s Democratic primary this month, well after it was clear he had no chance to become the party’s presidential nominee.

Now that Mr. Sanders has dropped out and endorsed former Vice President Joseph R. Biden Jr., Ms. Shippee is torn over whether to once again cast a vote for a moderate Democrat in November, after grudgingly supporting Hillary Clinton in 2016 and President Barack Obama in 2012.

“What it feels like is the Democratic Party relies on guilting progressives into voting for them, and they don’t want to have any meaningful changes,” said Ms. Shippee, 31, a nursing student in Milwaukee. “For the third election in a row, to have a candidate you’re not excited about makes me a little more interested in voting third party.”

Despite Mr. Sanders’s call to unite behind Mr. Biden to defeat President Trump — whom the Vermont senator described as “the most dangerous president” of modern times — and despite Mr. Obama’s assurance that the party had moved left since he left office, the youthful and impassioned army of Sanders supporters is far from ready to embrace a nominee so unlike the one they pinned their dreams on.

In interviews with two dozen Sanders primary voters across the country this week, there was a nearly universal lack of enthusiasm for Mr. Biden, the presumptive Democratic nominee. Some called him a less formidable candidate than Hillary Clinton was in 2016. Many were skeptical of his ability to beat Mr. Trump. Others were quick to critique Mr. Biden’s sometimes incoherent speech.

Taken together, the voters’ doubts raised questions about how many would show up for Mr. Biden in November, including their likelihood to volunteer and organize for him, an important measure of enthusiasm. In a poll last month, four out of five Sanders supporters said they would vote for Mr. Biden, with 15 percent saying they would cross over to Mr. Trump, about the same share that did so in 2016.

Te’wuan Thorne, 24, said it was “up in the air” whether he would vote. A Sanders supporter who recently moved to New York City from Pennsylvania, where he is registered to vote, he said, “If I happen to be at my polling place, I would vote for Biden, but I’m not very enthusiastic about him whatsoever.”

Some Sanders primary voters said they would back a third-party candidate, a few said they would vote for Mr. Trump, and some were wavering about voting at all. Daniel Ray, 27, of Lancaster, Penn., planned to write in Tulsi Gabbard, the congresswoman from Hawaii who ended her long-shot bid for the Democratic nomination last month.

In Facebook groups for Sanders supporters and on Twitter, cynicism persisted about the olive branches on policy that Mr. Biden has offered to progressives and, at the extreme, some accused Mr. Sanders of selling out his leftist movement.

It is clear, if it wasn’t already, that the Sanders base is far different from the supporters of moderate candidates in the primaries, who moved on quickly from their first choices to coalesce around Mr. Biden early last month. For Mr. Sanders, bringing his people on board will not be easy, even though he endorsed Mr. Biden with seeming affection and months earlier than he did Mrs. Clinton in 2016.

Nathaniel Kesselring of Tucson voted for Mr. Sanders in the Arizona primary but said he would not vote for Mr. Biden because progressives should not compromise on issues like “Medicare for all” and free public college tuition.

“If we don’t declare as a movement that this isn’t good enough,” Mr. Kesselring said, referring to Mr. Biden’s moderate policies, “then the Democratic Party has every right to ignore us. I hate the idea of Donald Trump being president for another term, but if that’s what we need to do to make these people take us seriously, that’s what needs to be done.”

“I hate it,” repeated Mr. Kesselring, 45, the vice president of a buyer’s club for diabetes products. “I hate it. But I’m not moving.”

Certainly, as polling shows, the majority of Sanders voters plan to support Mr. Biden. Most of those interviewed who intend to do so called it a hold-your-nose election.

“I will vote for him; Biden is better than Trump, sure,” said Stephen Phillips, 33, who lives in Lakeland, Fla., and has been furloughed from his job in talent recruitment because of the coronavirus outbreak. But he cringed watching Mr. Sanders’s live-streamed endorsement of Mr. Biden on Monday, when the senator spoke extemporaneously while the former vice president seemed to be reading off cue cards. “This guy is going to be running against Donald Trump, who off the cuff can destroy anybody with words.”

Maria Aviles-Hernandez, 24, a Spanish teacher near Rocky Mount, N.C., didn’t vote in 2016 but plans to support Mr. Biden, although Mr. Sanders was her first choice. “I will vote this year, I will make sure of that,” she said. “I didn’t expect Trump to win the first time. The world just surprised me. I don’t want that to happen again.”

A challenge for Mr. Biden in the fall is that even if he has the grudging support of Sanders voters, many may not go out of their way to vote, either by applying for absentee ballots or by traveling home if they are students.

“For a college student, the barriers to get to the voting place are very real,” said Victoria Waring, 21, whose family home is in central Pennsylvania but who attends college in Philadelphia, studying film and animation. “A lot of my friends are disillusioned with the Democratic Party, they feel there’s nothing they can do to be represented, that the establishment will pick whoever they want and it doesn’t matter what we say.”

In 2016, before she was old enough to vote, Ms. Waring organized for Jill Stein, the Green Party candidate. Ms. Waring said she would not volunteer this year for the Biden campaign. “How could I in good faith tell someone to vote for someone who I don’t agree with on any issue?” she asked. “I can’t. No. Absolutely not.”

One survey after the 2016 election indicated that 12 percent of Mr. Sanders’s primary voters ended up voting for Mr. Trump in the general election. Another 8 percent of Sanders supporters voted for a third-party candidate, and 3 percent did not vote. The numbers were in line with past elections when a losing candidate’s primary voters did not support the nominee. But because the 2016 race was so close, with Mr. Trump winning by less than one percentage point in three crucial Rust Belt states, the Sanders drop-off voters helped tilt the election away from Mrs. Clinton.

Younger voters, who overwhelmingly backed Mr. Sanders in this year’s primary race, said Mr. Biden seemed like just another politician with wishy-washy positions on climate change and health care. What they craved, they said, was the type of fundamental change that Mr. Sanders has espoused for decades.

“Joe Biden, he seems fake to me,” said Jacob Davids, 21, a college student in Milwaukee. “I don’t know his policies, and if you haven’t put enough effort into P.R. and media to make viewers like me know where you stand, I’m not going to vote for you.”

Kevin Ridler, 55, voted for Mr. Sanders in this year’s Democratic primary and cast a ballot for Mr. Trump in the 2016 general election. Mr. Ridler lives in rural western Iowa and is the president of a railway maintenance workers’ local in the Midwest. He said he had believed Mr. Trump’s promises that he would be a friend of American workers. Immediately after the election, Mr. Ridler said, his union’s railroad employer refused to renegotiate a contract, citing a “new political climate,” and workers were forced to take a pay cut.

Mr. Ridler now calls his vote for Mr. Trump “a mistake” that he will not repeat.

He supported Mr. Sanders in Iowa’s caucuses. But he has a powerful dislike of Mr. Biden, whom he called dishonest, throwing in a few epithets. “I think he’s got dementia,” he said.

“Honestly, I hate to not vote at all,” he said, speaking from a railway bridge under construction outside Jefferson City, Mo. “I know that’s not the right thing to do, but that’s kind of what’s going to happen here.”

Robert Grullon, 29, a carpenter at a door factory near Melbourne, Fla., liked Mr. Sanders’s promises to raise the minimum wage and provide health care for all. “We love Bernie,” he said. “Bernie’s our guy.”

He complained that Hispanic voters and black voters — he is third-generation Dominican-American — tend to support Democrats but don’t get much back. “When are they going to have something for blacks and Hispanics, just for us?” he said. Mr. Biden struck him as just another politician in a blue suit.

“To tell you the truth, Trump might get my vote,” he said. “Donald Trump is a person who’s always been known in our community — I like hip-hop — we idolized him because he was a billionaire, he has been in rap videos, he has friends who are African-American.”

In eastern Iowa on Tuesday, Kelly Manning had just finished her route as a letter carrier for the Postal Service, which has lost millions in revenue during the pandemic even as Mr. Trump tries to block relief funding for the agency. Ms. Manning, 55, caucused for Mr. Sanders in Burlington, on the Mississippi River. She heard Mr. Biden speak when he came through Iowa, though she said he had made her nearly doze off.

“I’ll hold my nose and vote for Biden,” she said.

Her 31-year-old son, Mason Blow, is another matter. A staunch Sanders supporter, he voted for a third-party candidate in 2016. Ms. Manning said she and her sister were “working on him” to vote for Mr. Biden, to prevent a second Trump term.

“He said he won’t vote for Biden, he’s going to write in Bernie this time,” Ms. Manning said. “The younger people, they’re not used to having their dream crushed as we are."

26 comments:

Dervish Sanders said...

So, you're not staying home because of how Dotard is handling the Coronavirus situation? Fauci not fired yet and WHEN is Dotard going to use his "absolute authority" to reopen the country? Dotard = "deep state" puppet.

-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jew said...

And you're just going to follow Noam Chumpski's advice and pull the lever for theEstablishment, no matter how much it disempowers you.

Who's the fool?

Dervish Sanders said...

I'd take advice from Noam Chomsky over Glenn Greenwald, YES. More importantly, Bernie Sanders says vote for Joe Biden. Not that it matters, as I live in a red state. And, as you point out, it's how the electors vote that matters -- not the will of the majority.

In any case, I very seriously doubt you give a damn about Progressives having the candidate they want. You post about Progressives staying home because you KNOW it favors Dotard. And because the African American turnout will likely be higher for Biden than for Clinton. That might have you a little scared.]

Dotard was going to run on how he artificially boosted the economy with huge tax cuts for corporations (while massively increasing the deficit). Hoping the rubes would believe the economy was doing so well due to his masterful stewardship. That's out the window now. Which must leave you doubly scared.

You aren't going to talk me into voting Dotard (by staying home or casting a third party vote).

Dervish Sanders said...

Glenn Greenwald is another denier of the obvious Russian collusion. Because I watch the videos you post, YouTube thinks I like that sort of bullshit. I was browsing YouTube yesterday and a Jimmy Dore video was suggested. It concerned Jimmy's take on Obama's Biden endorsement. In it he expresses his utter contempt for Obama. He must consider it his life's work to help keep republicans in power.

As per your Glenn Greenwald video, voting for the "lesser of two evils" when Reagan was the nominee was OK, but with Dotard it isn't. I wouldn't take advice from either of these pro-Dotard fools.

-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jew said...

Glenn Greenwald IS the Left. Admit it, you aren't a Progressive. You're Neoliberal Establishment, anti- Progressive.

Dervish Sanders said...

I can't "admit" to falsities. I strongly support Bernie Sanders -- the candidate all these other "progressives" YOU say make up the "intellectually honest left". But when Bernie Sanders says getting rid of Dotard is of utmost importance, they turn on him. For having the gall to not want to hand Dotard a second term. To teach the Democratic establishment a lesson by burning down the country.

Quote: ...Greenwald and others have stated, the libertarian left's primary goal is the disintegration of the two party system by pursuing a long-term effort to undermine the Democratic Party, even if it means the election of more Republicans and the enacting of conservative policies like voter ID, corporate deregulation and the further erosion of reproductive rights. [end quote]

The path to victory for the Progressive Left is to take over the Democratic Party. Just as Dotard took over the republican party. Not to destroy the Democratic Party and help republicans. Much as you wish that's what discouraged Lefties like me would do. Glenn Greenwald is NOT the Left.

Dervish Sanders said...

You need to admit that you're a Neoliberal Establishment, anti-Conservative.

-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jew said...

You are right about one thing. I've got no love for conserving the post WWII corporate globalist world order aka Neoliberal establishment.

Dervish Sanders said...

Sounds like you're going to write in "Bernie Sanders" when you cast your vote for potus.

-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jew said...

Nope. Why would I vote for a COMINTERN like Bernie.

-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jew said...

Trump Nationalism (not White) forever!

Dervish Sanders said...

Dotard Nationalism IS White Nationalism. And 2 terms (if he manages to steal another) isn't "forever". Anyway, sad that your love of White Nationalism and delusions keep you from making the rational choice. Bernie is definitely not a "comintern", but he is Jewish.

-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jew said...

Nationalsm isn't White Nationalism, just as Social Justice isn't Justice (for Individuals). But then Socialists like yourself do tend to confuse both terms from within their ideological bias'.

Dervish Sanders said...

I'm not confused :(

-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jew said...

lol! The Jewish white nationalist strikes!

BWAH-HA-HA-HA!

Dervish Sanders said...

Quote: Twenty-five Jewish House members called on President Trump to fire Senior Adviser Stephen Miller over leaked emails showing he promoted stories from white nationalist media publications. "As Jewish members of Congress, we are calling on you to immediately relieve White House Senior Advisor Stephen Miller of all government responsibilities and dismiss him from your Administration", the lawmakers wrote in a letter... "His documented support for white nationalist and virulently anti-immigrant tropes is wholly unacceptable and disqualifying for a government employee". [end quote]

Other Jews say Miller promotes White Nationalism. How a person SHOULD behave doesn't negate how they actually DO behave (your illogical argument).

Joe Conservative said...

25 Jewish Sanhedrin leaders also condemned the Jew Jesus to Herod....
what's your point? That Jesus was a white nationalist?

Dervish Sanders said...

Do you believe that Jesus existed? A person who never existed couldn't have been a White Nationalist. Also, Jesus was likely brown-skinned. He was someone Stephen Miller and predisent Dotard (as White Nationalists) would want to ban from entering the US, in other words.

Leviticus 19:33-34: When immigrants live in your land with you, you must not cheat them. Any immigrant who lives with you must be treated as if they were one of your citizens. You must love them as yourself, because you were immigrants in the land of Egypt; I am the Lord your God.

Jesus strongly opposed (your religion of) White Nationalism!

-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jew said...

Why would Stephen Miller waant to ban Jews aand why would a non-existent person, according to you, have brown skin?

Dervish Sanders said...

I'm not a White Nationalist. You'll have to ask him. And you're the one who said he isn't a Christian. Naturally my assumption is you believe there was no Jesus.

Joe Conservative said...

Why would I believe that a man named Jesus didn't exist?

Joe Conservative said...

...because I refuse to believe that he was my G_d?

Joe Conservative said...

I don't believe that Mohammed didn't exist. I don't believe that David Koresch didn't exist.

Dervish Sanders said...

I wasn't talking about "a man named Jesus". I was referring to a SPECIFIC man named Jesus. The one described in the Christian Bible. If you believe he existed (as described in the Bible) then you're a Christian. Unless you're rooting for Satan. But those people (Franco, for example) usually lie and claim to be Christian too.

-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jew said...

The Bible couldn't have exaggerated an actual man's deeds? Who knew?

-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jew said...

I'm NOT a Christian and I don't believe that all the events happened as described. The Bible was compiled and edited to support a Grand Narrative, much like the NY Times and WaPo. Are all the people mentioned in their articles about "not actually existing people" too?