Saturday, June 10, 2023

2023 - Snark's Triumph Over Science in the Society of the Spectacle


Liel Leibovitz, "Do You Remember 2005?"
Twenty years ago, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. explained his views about vaccines on The Daily Show—and was met with respect and interest. In the years since, what’s changed?

Now that Succession is over, I’ve got something else to binge on. It’s only seven minutes and two seconds long, but it’s arguably less predictable and more dramatic. It’s an interview on The Daily Show—the original one, with Jon Stewart, before it soured into a mess so rancid it can’t even find a permanent host—from July 20, 2005. The guest? Robert F. Kennedy Jr., there to talk about thimerosal, the mercury compound used as a preservative in some vaccines and which Kennedy believes is the likely cause of various neurological disorders as well as the reason for the spike in autism in the U.S.

RFK Jr.’s message is the same one he delivers today. “It’s not all vaccinations,” he told Stewart, just the ones that use the substance he deems unsafe. Stewart pushes back, at one point asking why the government would conspire to suppress his arguments, even at the price of public health. RFK, Jr. responds. And so on and so forth. Which is to say: The entire interview is driven by curiosity and good faith and ends with respect: “It’s a remarkable story,” Stewart says. “I wish we had more time, but I appreciate you getting the word out and I know parents of kids with autism truly appreciate it. I know it’s a very difficult thing for them to be dealing with, so I’m sure they appreciate the help and support.”

That was 18 years ago.

Back then, the very same ideas, expressed the very same way, earned RFK Jr. a friendly, measured spot on the nation’s hottest television program. Today, it brings him smug condescension and often vicious contempt, from The New York Times announcement of his run for president informing readers that his campaign would be “built on re-litigating Covid-19 shutdowns and shaking Americans’ faith in science” to the Center for Countering Digital Hate placing him on its “Disinformation Dozen” list and demanding that his social media accounts be blocked. “He’s a crazy conspiracy theorist,” Times opinion columnist Farhad Manjoo shot back at someone on Twitter who dared to wonder why RFK Jr. might deserve attention, the smear rolling off Manjoo’s keyboard with the ease of someone receiving talking points from the Politburo instead of doing the work of having thoughts of his own.

What changed?

It’s a vitally important question for anyone wishing to understand our current collective lunacy, so let’s take the scientific approach. We know RFK Jr. is saying the same things he did in 2005, so he’s the constant in this equation. Could it be, then, that the years that passed since his Daily Show appearance brought with them a deluge of new facts and findings that make the same statements sound so much more odious? That, after all, is how science—the real deal, not the hashtag sort—works, constantly reviewing new information to test old hypotheses.

But the science concerning thimerosal has been largely settled since … 2001. Four years earlier, in 1997, the FDA revamped procedures and standards, and asked pharmaceutical companies to report on the thimerosal content in their drugs. The data came in mid-1999 and left the experts appointed to review it split. Here’s how Dr. Paul A. Offit, co-inventor of the RotaTeq vaccine, put it in that hotbed of radicalism, the New England Journal of Medicine: “Several attendees left the meeting concerned that infants might be receiving too much mercury from vaccines,” he wrote. “On July 9, 1999, after much wrangling, the CDC and AAP [American Academy of Pediatrics] decided to exercise the precautionary principle. They asked pharmaceutical companies to remove thimerosal from vaccines as quickly as possible; in the interim, they asked doctors to delay the birth dose of hepatitis B vaccine in children who weren’t at risk for hepatitis.”

A concern emerged that messaging the decision improperly would lead to reluctance to vaccinate children, which prompted the U.S. National Academy of Sciences’ Institute of Medicine to issue another report two years later. Here’s its conclusion (bold in the original text): “Based on this body of evidence, the committee concludes that the evidence favors rejection of a causal relationship between thimerosal-containing vaccines and autism.”

In the 2005 interview, Stewart brings much of this to the fore, and has a nuanced, interested, and thought-provoking conversation with RFK Jr., who fully acknowledges the concerns well-meaning public health officials may have about the ways the general population might misjudge risks and benefits if given information it doesn’t fully understand. Which is why, RFK Jr. concluded bluntly, the best policy is simply to tell the messy and complicated truth and trust that people are smart enough to make their own informed decisions.

If you’ve paid any attention during COVID, you know that RFK Jr.’s counsel went unheeded. There are too many examples of this to choose from, but my favorite one is CDC Director Dr. Rochelle Walensky stating, in a White House press conference four months after the vaccines were first distributed, that her agency recommends that pregnant women get the shot. The agency’s own website, however, made it clear that the agency simply didn’t have enough data to make any sweeping guarantees, as pregnancies last nine months and as vaccines simply hadn’t been around long enough for anyone to say with any certainty that they would have no effect on fetal development.

And so, QED: Eighteen years after his Daily Show appearance, RFK Jr. is the same RFK Jr., and the science is the same science. That’s more than we can say for those who call themselves “liberal” or “progressive” or “left wing” and still fancy themselves smart or educated. Once upon a time, these cats were able to do as Jon Stewart had done all those years ago: ask probing questions, listen politely, and acknowledge that a person making an argument you dislike—even one you believe is wrong—is not necessarily a peril to be eliminated or a threat to be silenced but a voice to be engaged.

These formerly smart people also used to understand that “science” wasn’t an article of faith—as in Fauci’s “I am the science” or the COVID-era mantra “trust the science”—but a disinterested method involving constantly arguing about facts, even those that seem settled.
No more: In 2018, for example, a senior Columbia University climate scientist, writing in Scientific American, thundered that she would no longer debate climate science. “Once you put the established facts about the world up for argument,” she wrote, “you’ve already lost.” Which is more or less what the Roman Inquisition said once Galileo suggested that the Earth revolved around the sun.

As Kennedy continues his presidential bid, it’s likely that we’ll hear more terms like “anti-vaxxer” or “conspiracy theory” or “disinformation” thrown about with cloying, sanctimonious gravitas. But if you want some real insight into the folks wildly brandishing these terms, just watch how they treated RFK Jr. not too long ago. He hasn’t changed a bit, but they, alas, have.
“‘You may seek it with thimbles—and seek it with care;
You may hunt it with forks and hope;
You may threaten its life with a railway-share;
You may charm it with smiles and soap—‘”

27 comments:

The Prophet Dervish Z Sanders said...

"Eighteen years after his Daily Show appearance, RFK Jr. is the same RFK Jr., and the science is the same science".

False and false. As far as I know, RFK Jr wasn't a Putin puppet 18 years ago. Also, that vaccines cause autism has been debunked.

Anonymous said...

"Who is mr.Putin?" was a question 18 years ago. ;-P

So, how anybody could be a puppet of Nodody???

The Prophet Dervish Z Sanders said...

18 years ago was 2005. Between 2004–2008 Putin was serving his second presidential term. Putin was a "nobody" then?

-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jew said...

Maybe RFK Jr was duped by his "disinformation"?

Anonymous said...

\\18 years ago was 2005. Between 2004–2008 Putin was serving his second presidential term. Putin was a "nobody" then?

And he was and still are prezident.
In times of 0-bama... so what, maybe 0-bama Putin's puppet too?

Well, he did many good on behalf of liliPut. Was his useful idiot. Like when pressed that Reboot Button. ;-P

The Prophet Dervish Z Sanders said...

Qtard: maybe 0-bama Putin's puppet too? ... Like when pressed that Reboot Button.

What "reboot button"???

On 6 March 2009 in Geneva, U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton presented Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov with a red button with the English word "reset" ... Lavrov and Clinton pushed the button simultaneously.

Obama (not "0-bama") did not press the button. It said "reset", not "reboot". btw, "Hillary Clinton defended the reset as a brilliant stroke, pointing to the Russian agreement to sanctions against Iran and permission to fly over its territory to supply joint NATO troops in Afghanistan".

Attempting to improve relations between two sovereign nations via diplomacy somehow makes Obama (not "0-bama") Putin's puppet? Or his "useful idiot"? How?

Anonymous said...

dRump "colluded" with liliPut... and there was NO (new) wars.

0-bama "improved relation via diplomacy"... and liliPut was aquited from responsiblity for starting war against sovereign nation (do you remember? 8/8/8 war? against Georgia), and than feeling himself unleashed to start MORE wars -- against Ukraine, bombing out Syria...

So... it makes me wonder -- what liliPut do thinking about it?
But well, he saying it him... itself -- he VERY LIKE "diplomatic" approach of 0-bama. ;-P

And want tp push more Reset Buttons. Reset Short Memory of USA, of war crimes of YOUR sworn enemy. Which when going to sleep dreaming about having dream about Total Annihilation of USA.

The Prophet Dervish Z Sanders said...

Barack Obama was president from 1/20/2009 to 1/20/2017. The Russo-Georgian War lasted from 8/7/2008 until 8/12/2008 (5 days). George W Bush was the US president at the time.

The following ("Demn propaganda" according to you, no doubt) is from a Brookings Institution article:

President Bush ruled out military action. His administration imposed modest penalties on Russia, ratcheting down bilateral relations, freezing a US-Russia civil nuclear cooperation agreement and ending support for Moscow's bid to join the World Trade Organization. US officials found that they had little leverage to affect Moscow's behavior.

The Obama administration has applied similar measures as it seeks to sway Putin again, but it has added a new penalty: visa and financial sanctions targeted at individual Russians, including some close to Putin. On March 20 [2014], the president also announced a new executive order to enable US sanctions against key sectors of the Russian economy, including finance, energy and defense — the kinds of tough penalties that the United States has not previously applied against Moscow. [3/24/2014].

In other words, Barack Obama did more to punish Russia for invading Georgia than the previous president, George W. Bush (the president under whose watch the war occurred). Yet, according to Qtard, all blame is attributable to Barack Obama.

Barack Obama never "aquited from responsiblity for starting war against sovereign nation".

Anonymous said...

\\Barack Obama never "aquited from responsiblity for starting war against sovereign nation".

Clearly an idiot.

It was said about liliPut, not 0-bama. Or... with that you admitting 0-bama being puppet of liliPut? ;-P

Or just ordinary idiotic trick to derail discussion.



\\In other words, Barack Obama did more to punish Russia for invading Georgia than the previous president, George W. Bush (the president under whose watch the war occurred).

Yeah??? And how Bush could do anything??? Being "lame duck". And after becameing ex shortly after that.

And what about track record. HOW that "punishment" worked? Did it stopped NEW crimes???

But we know already -- liliPut feeled himself THAT "punished", that he started a war in Ukraine and then bombing out Syria. Do you remember reaction of liliPut to all "red lines" from 0-bama in Syria???
Definitly, Zero-Bama. ;-P



\\Barack Obama was president from 1/20/2009 to 1/20/2017. The Russo-Georgian War lasted from 8/7/2008 until 8/12/2008 (5 days). George W Bush was the US president at the time.

Means... Zero-Bobama HAVE HAD 8(EIGHT) damn years to introduce "severe punishment". While being fully in charge and at his prime political power.

While Bush have had just several months... at the end of his term.

"Blame all at Reps". That is what it's called.

The Prophet Dervish Z Sanders said...

Qtard: \\Barack Obama never "aquited from responsiblity for starting war against sovereign nation". Clearly an idiot.

I assumed you meant that Barack Obama acquitted Putin. I did not think you were saying that Obama started the war.

Barack Obama never "aquited [Putin] from responsiblity for starting war against sovereign nation". He imposed sanctions. WTF does Qtard think Barack Obama should have done?

Qtard: Zero-Bobama HAVE HAD 8(EIGHT) damn years to introduce "severe punishment". While being fully in charge and at his prime political power.

The Obama administration has applied similar measures [to the gwb administration] ... but ... added a new penalty: visa and financial sanctions targeted at individual Russians, including some close to Putin. On March 20 [2014], the president also announced a new executive order to enable US sanctions against key sectors of the Russian economy, including finance, energy and defense — the kinds of tough penalties that the United States has not previously applied against Moscow.

Blame all on Democrats. That is what it's called. Or "Demns" in Qtardese. WTF would this "severe punishment" have been?

Anonymous said...

\\Qtard: \\Barack Obama never "aquited from responsiblity for starting war against sovereign nation". Clearly an idiot.

\\I assumed you meant that Barack Obama acquitted Putin. I did not think you were saying that Obama started the war.

Why you make such a misguiding quotes then?

To try to cought me off guard. Like if I'd continue saying something about Obama -- you'd started claiming that I accuse him falsely?

Or... that is just showing in what sore state your mind is?




\\Barack Obama never "aquited [Putin] from responsiblity for starting war against sovereign nation". He imposed sanctions. WTF does Qtard think Barack Obama should have done?

And if in result of it, NEW wars would start -- Obama (or any othe Demn) is not guilty, because "what else could they do"???

Like just now, Bi-den, trying to appease crazy mullahs of Iran... while allowing em to refine some more Plutonium for their new bombs.

And that... while they declared and demonstratad new missiles for that bombs. With over 2000 miles range.

And when Iran will became brand new nuclear weapon wielder and will start terrorize World with it...

That would be YOUR Demn's answer AGAIN??? "What could we do", yes???




\\WTF does Qtard think Barack Obama should have done?

Again.

Operation Crome Dome. ;-P



\\Blame all on Democrats. That is what it's called. Or "Demns" in Qtardese. WTF would this "severe punishment" have been?

Clearly an idiot. Who do not frakingly understand that that is not "passing blame" game.

That is -- Real World Problem.

And you even tryed to say that you was discussing politics HERE. And me being "involved" in that "discussions".

While you freakingly and utmostly HAVE NO IDEA what politics is about -- it about SOLVING Real World Problems.

Not about playing game of words, of passing blame, of smearing opponents... and other miserly treaks of an idiots.

Because...

When H-bomb will come to visit your home -- YOU will not be able to "talk it out", with it. :-(((((

And your. Demns. Such an infantile behavior. That is what makes chanses for H-bombs to visit homes of people of the World only higher and HIGHER!!!



PS This my comment. I admit. Somehove resemble me being involved in your inner political brawls, and talking about your politics.

But that, conditioned on what you'd answer to it.

And I bet, you'd continue playing dumb. ;-P

The Prophet Dervish Z Sanders said...

Qtard: \\WTF does Qtard think Barack Obama should have done?\\ Again. Operation Crome Dome

I thought you were criticizing it. But no? You thought it was a good idea and the US should do it again? If not, then you gave no answer.

Qtard: \\WTF would this "severe punishment" have been?\\ Clearly an idiot. Who do not frakingly understand that that is not "passing blame" game.

No answer. Just playing "passing blame" game.

Qtard: Like just now, Bi-den, trying to appease crazy mullahs of Iran... while allowing em to refine some more Plutonium for their new bombs.

That is donald tRump's fault. 100 percent. donald tRump allowed it by withdrawing the US from the JCPOA. But you'll find a way to blame Obama or Biden, for sure. Because Qtard has no interest in solving real world problems. Only playing the "passing blame" game.

Anonymous said...

\\I thought you were criticizing it. But no? You thought it was a good idea and the US should do it again? If not, then you gave no answer.

It was effective.

Against all kinds of crazy tyrants trying to terrorise World with using Nukes.

Have own(what am I asking??? FACEPALM) Have BETTER idea(s)???



\\That is donald tRump's fault.

Yap.

Passing blame game. Of own Demn brand "Blame all on REPS!!!". :-)))))))))))))))



\\And I bet, you'd continue playing dumb. ;-P

Was that my prophesy NOT true??? Was it? :-))))))))))))))))))))))))

The Prophet Dervish Z Sanders said...

Qtard: Was that my prophesy NOT true??? Was it?

Prophecy? Sounds like a word a religious bonker would use. Did "gawd" whisper this "prophesy" in your ear, Qtard? Does "gawd" tell Qtard to "blame all on Demns"?

The holy Qtard, prophet of "gawd". LOL.

Qtard's prophesy that Vlad Putin (acquitted by 0-bama) will send an H-bomb to my home has yet to come true. Do you have a time-frame on the prophesy, Qtard? Just wondering how long I have left to live.

Anonymous said...

:-)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))




\\Qtard's prophesy that Vlad Putin (acquitted by 0-bama) will send an H-bomb to my home...

Derpy THE Idiot

unable to grasp IF THEN conditional statment?

Naturally. ;-P

That is just that much an idiot... it is. :-)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jew said...

So when is the Global Warming prophesy going to materialize, dervy? The Ice Caps are still in place and the polar bears haven't become extinct...

Dervish Sanders said...

Arctic summer sea ice could be gone by as early as 2035. When the model was run forward in time, it predicted that Arctic sea ice would all but disappear by 2035.

Two-thirds of the world's polar bears could be extinct by 2050 if greenhouse gas-fueled global warming keeps melting their Arctic sea-ice habitat.

FYI, these are science-based predictions, not prophecies.

Anonymous said...

Means... it could be 100% false. As it had happened with "science-based predictions" not once. ;-P

Anonymous said...

Well.

Anyway.

That is NOT "science-based predictions".

As "science-based predictions" MEANS that some LAW of NATURE became known.

Like -- Newton's Gravity -- allowed to "predict" dcientifically movment of the planets.

That is... just an "estimates". From some "models". Bleh.

Produced by political orders of one particular political party.

For the sake of basing propaganda of that party on it.

Self-fulfilling "prophesies". ;-P

Anonymous said...

My comment here missing.

Or... that is gods of communication, again? :-/

The Prophet Dervish Z Sanders said...

Qtard: Produced by political orders of one particular political party. For the sake of basing propaganda of that party on it.

Non-US climatologists don't take orders from US political parties. US-based climatologists don't take any "orders" either. Not that any "orders" are being given. Qtard's "orders" claim is paranoid tinfoil hat nuttery.

Anonymous said...

But, do they NOT recieve grants??? For their researches.

Can they be NOT fooled with so loud narrative? ;-P

Well... DO YOU recieve ANY orders to spread propaganda BS here?

Dervish Sanders said...

No, they receive no grants. Climate change Scientists are all independently wealthy do-gooders who do all their research at their own expense.

Anonymous said...

:-))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

Yap-yap-yap.

And princesses do not shit. :-)))))))))))))))))))))))))))

Dervish Sanders said...

Donald Trump Says That Wife Melania Doesn’t Fart or Poop. Howard Stern... asked Trump if Melania ever "makes a doody". Trump replied, "I’ve never seen any, it’s amazing. Maybe they save that for after marriage".

Anonymous said...

Inability to understand irony.

+1

Yawn.

Dervish Sanders said...

Where is your "irony banner"???